King Ralph's era coming to an end?
After the stunning approval of only 55% at Ralph Klein's leadership review, I would be very surprised if he is still premier at the end of the year. While I agree he stayed on a little too long, he did promise to quit in the fall of 2007, so I think the Alberta PCs should have let him do that just as the Liberals let Chretien quit on his own terms. This certainly delays any health care reforms, although hopefully all the candidates for the PC leadership will continue to push for health reforms, but at least do a better job explaining them. Much of the opposition to the Third Way stemmed from the belief that those who couldn't afford health insurance would go without health care, which is off course untrue.
Despite being a Liberal federally, I am a former Progressive Conservative and I would have voted for the Alberta PCs in 2001 and 2004 had I lived in Alberta. Ralph Klein deserves a lot of credit for turning Alberta's finances around and making it the only debt free province, lowest taxes in Canada, one of the best health care in terms of wait times, and the strongest economy in Canada. While it is true some of this had to do with oil, lets remember oil prices weren't very high in the mid 90s when the budget was balanced, that came later. The budget was balanced because Ralph Klein made the necessary sacrifices to turn Alberta around. He no doubt said and did some stupid things like going into a homeless shelter drunk and throwing a book at a legislative page, but he was a man who understood how to run an effective government. He was also a populist who related to the average person. Unlike many other politicians who cloak their statements in window dressing, he told you exactly what he thought, so even if you didn't agree with him, you knew what he stood for.
As for his successor, my choice is Jim Dinning. Besides the fact he sits on the board for Western Financial Group where I used to work, he has shown himself as a strong finance minister. He also understands the importance of R&D as well as strong relations with the rest of Canada and is willing to tackle the necessary health reforms to reform health care. Preston Manning may have some good ideas, but he is yesterday's man, while Ted Morton is way too right wing for me. I would take Stephen Harper over Ted Morton. This guy is to the right of George W. Bush and to the right of the Alberta Alliance, so although the chances of him winning are a longshot, I would vote Alberta Liberal if he won and I lived in Alberta come next election. Hopefully if not Jim Dinning, than Mark Norris or Dave Hancock will become leader, although that does not mean I wouldn't vote Alberta PC if I lived in Alberta and they choose someone else.
Despite being a Liberal federally, I am a former Progressive Conservative and I would have voted for the Alberta PCs in 2001 and 2004 had I lived in Alberta. Ralph Klein deserves a lot of credit for turning Alberta's finances around and making it the only debt free province, lowest taxes in Canada, one of the best health care in terms of wait times, and the strongest economy in Canada. While it is true some of this had to do with oil, lets remember oil prices weren't very high in the mid 90s when the budget was balanced, that came later. The budget was balanced because Ralph Klein made the necessary sacrifices to turn Alberta around. He no doubt said and did some stupid things like going into a homeless shelter drunk and throwing a book at a legislative page, but he was a man who understood how to run an effective government. He was also a populist who related to the average person. Unlike many other politicians who cloak their statements in window dressing, he told you exactly what he thought, so even if you didn't agree with him, you knew what he stood for.
As for his successor, my choice is Jim Dinning. Besides the fact he sits on the board for Western Financial Group where I used to work, he has shown himself as a strong finance minister. He also understands the importance of R&D as well as strong relations with the rest of Canada and is willing to tackle the necessary health reforms to reform health care. Preston Manning may have some good ideas, but he is yesterday's man, while Ted Morton is way too right wing for me. I would take Stephen Harper over Ted Morton. This guy is to the right of George W. Bush and to the right of the Alberta Alliance, so although the chances of him winning are a longshot, I would vote Alberta Liberal if he won and I lived in Alberta come next election. Hopefully if not Jim Dinning, than Mark Norris or Dave Hancock will become leader, although that does not mean I wouldn't vote Alberta PC if I lived in Alberta and they choose someone else.
posted by Monkey Loves to Fight at 7:30 PM
18 Comments:
Sorry to stomp on this worthy thread, but I was sure you would want to know:
VANCOUVER - A former top B.C. provincial government aide received more than $24,000 in cheques from a man connected to a lobbying firm whose U.S. client was in the bidding for the $1-billion privatization of BC Rail, according to search warrant documents released Monday.
The cheques and cheque stubs were found during a Dec. 28, 2003, search of the Vancouver home of Erik Bornman.
Bornman's company, Pacific Public Affairs, issued the cheques for "contract writing services" to Aneal Basi, then a public affairs officer with the Transportation Ministry.
Basi then allegedly transferred the money to the bank account of his cousin, Udhe Singh (Dave) Basi, who at the time was an assistant to then B.C. finance minister Gary Collins.
Bornman was a former communications director for the federal Liberal party in B.C. and a member of Paul Martin's leadership campaign committee.
I know that you're all caught up with issues vital to the nation, such as what Stephen Harper is wearing, or whether Stephen Harper is giving interviews to the media today on the main, second or third floor of Parliament - but thought that you might find this of passing interest.
AB /ba
Anonymous, this is the BC Liberal party, which is completely independent of the federal Liberal party although the individuals involved were active in both. But so what. The police are investigating and I am sure they will do their job. I am a card carrying member of the BC Liberals and have been since 2001.
You say this was completey independent of the Federal Liberal party.
Funny, I'm sue that I read: Bornman was a former communications director for the federal Liberal party in B.C. and a member of Paul Martin's leadership campaign committee.
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I am simply pointing out the BC Liberals and federal Liberals are completely separate. Now some individuals are active in both parties, but you cannot link what happened in one to another. I happen to be a member of the BC Liberals and a supporter of the federal Liberals.
To repeat:
Bornman was a former communications director for the federal Liberal party in B.C. and a member of Paul Martin's leadership campaign committee.
In other words, there may be or may not be a connection to the LPC. "He's not saying....."
So, there were a few corrupt members, but you will get that in any party. I am sure you would get that once the Tories have been in power for some time.
Thankfully you are not voting in Alberta. Dinning as well is yesterday's man who, similar to Paul Martin, was able to be a decent finance minister under a more competent party leader. Mr. Dinning has been out of office for about 9 years and is clearly yesterdays man with a weak voice for Alberta within Canada. Agreed Morton is out there.
Anonymous - I disagree that Dinning is yesterday's man. Now is the time to look towards the future. The next leader should be about building bridges with the rest of Canada, not firewalls around Alberta. I agree the Liberals in the past have treated Alberta not very well, but now is the time for Canadians from coast to coast to work together rather than putting their own regional interest first.
And if not Dinning, who do you suggest since Manning and Morton would both make Alberta the laughingstock of Canada. Ralph Klein for all his flaws was at least well-respected in other parts of Canada.
Yah, you're so right Miles.
Dinning would certainly never say something stupid or be an embarassment to Alberta I understand your motive, Dinning would be godsend to the Alberta Liberals.
Careful now, you are very close to calling Albertans a laughing stock How positively divisive of you Miles but that seems to be your middle name right?
Anonymous - Dinning would not help the Liberals. Most of my family lives in Alberta and I was just there this past weekend and contrary to what some think, most Albertans are centre-right not far right. Manning was popular as leader of the Reform Party since he was fighting for the West to have a voice in Ottawa and most who voted for him probably didn't know or care what his policies were since he had no chance of winning. On the other hand, once Albertans see just how extreme his policies are, I suspect many moderate Tories would go elsewhere.
Also I don't want the Alberta Liberals to win, but I don't want the Alberta Progressive Conservatives to be a carbon copy of the Alberta Alliance. Right wing wackos can join the Alberta Alliance and leave the Alberta PCs for moderates.
And yes anonymous, electing Reform/Alliance MPs made both Alberta and British Columbia (where I am from) laughing stocks due to their extreme views. Thankfully BC has quit voting for them, while the Tories have moderated enough and were always moderate provincially the Alberta doesn't look like a laughingstock. In fact many in Ontario would happily trade Dalton McGuinty for Ralph Klein, but I doubt many would trade Dalton for Manning.
"And yes anonymous, electing Reform/Alliance MPs made both Alberta and British Columbia (where I am from) laughing stocks due to their extreme views."
Quite clearly, you are very opinionated in your belief system. B.C. is a laughing stock due to the fact that they elect people like Hedy Fry and Svend Robinson. Stockwell Day is odd as well in a different way. Also, B.C. continually hurts its own economy by electing NDP governments.
Jim Dinning would be a very weak premier, just like Don Getty. I am hardly right-wing (pro-choice, SSM ambivalent, atheist, heavy on green issues) but Preston Manning is a man who stands for principles and doesn't vacilate based on the winds of the day.
Agreed, Albertan are center right and Preston Manning is perfect for them. Don't go on my word, Albertans will prove that out. Dinning has been running for this job for almost 10 years yet most Albertans couldn't name one thing Cowboy Jim stands for. Manning already has 3 clear interests for Alberta.
I saw the G&M article where most Canadians would choose Ralph for their premier over McGuinty and Charest. Unfortunately for Ralph, even Calgarians are tired of his lack of vision.
Honest to god, a B.Cer calling Albertans a laughing stock is a bit rich.
I believe that electing people like Sharon Hayes, Bob Rigma, and Stockwell Day did hurt BC's image. Now off course electing the NDP provincially also screwed BC over, however they have since been thrown out of office and despite the cuts Gordon Campbell made (which I totally support), they thankfully lost the last election. They are a good opposition, but they are a disaster in government.
Preston Manning may have some good ideas, but I suggest that people look back at the Reform Party's platform and decide if that is the type of policies they want implemented. It is one thing to vote for a party that will only form the official opposition, but it is quite another thing to support the same party if they can actually form government. Jim Dinning is a far better choice. But if you don't like him, I would suggest Dave Hancock or Mike Norris would be a good choice. I think considering they are from Edmonton where the PCs didn't do particularly well might be a good thing despite the fact they are both moderates. I have family from Edmonton and many feel that the Alberta PCs favour Calgary over Edmonton and choosing Manning would only continue this stereotype. In fact my family from Southern Alberta think Ralph Klein is great, while my family from Edmonton dislike the guy.
I would certainly take Ralph Klein over Dalton McGuinty and probably over Jean Charest, although despite his unpopularity in Quebec, I think Jean Charest is doing a good job. I think his biggest problem is Quebec is generally left leaning and so his centre-right policies don't sell well amongst most Quebecers and for the centre-right Quebecers, the Action Democratique already is available so having two centre-right parties might make sense in Alberta, but not Quebec.
I am not saying Alberta is a laughing stock, in fact most Canadians admire Alberta for its success and Ralph Klein is quite well respected nationally. However, choosing Manning as premier would change this.
Hi Miles,
Ralph’s retirement is going to possibly be a much bigger event than people imagine.
Love him or hate him, Ralph managed to keep the various camps in Alberta’s PC Party working together, or at least keeping their quarrels inside the caucus. I’m not sure his replacement will do so well.
Alberta’s Tories are even more politically diverse than are B.C.s Liberals, so the leader will have a challenge. Waiting on the right to take in disaffected members post leadership will be the Alliance and the Liberals will happily embrace any disaffected red Tories.
I can’t predict how it will turn out but I think Jim Dinning is as much yesterday’s man as Preston Manning. Dave Hancock will be viewed as too left and Lyle Oberg, besides being the man with the smoking assassin’s gun and loose cannon to boot, will be seen as too far on the right – a Ted Morton light if you will.
Mark Norris has his own problems, not being able to get elected in “Redmonton,” being only the start. Part of the reason Norris lost is because he foolishly got pulled into the two airport debate and guess who he counts among his financial backers: Albert Cooper – owner of the airline trying to undo the airport policy that Edmontonians finally agreed on.
So, maybe someone else? Iris Evans is thinking of running. She’s centre-left but, at 64, either too old or just right because she won’t want to stay forever. She also knows just about every school trustee and municipal counselor that’s ever been in Alberta and understands better than anyone how to consult with Albertans.
Then there’s the fascinating rumour that senior Tories were encouraging Edmonton Mayor Stephen Mandel to run. Stephen is a fiscal conservative and social libertarian who also has a delightful love of the arts and propensity to speak plainly. The condensed schedule works against Mandel however, indeed almost any outsider.
I would suggest Ed Stelmach as a possible winner, even though I almost forgot him myself just now. No doubt though, Stelmach has been around, knows the party, sits just slightly right of centre and will get strong rural organizing support. He alone also has the advantage of being from neither Edmonton or Calgary, if that’s a good thing.
Whomever wins, they'll need a strong personality to keep the Tory "big tent" from collapsing. Otherwise the biggest winner could be Liberal leader Kevin Taft, and don't tink he doesn't know it!
Cheers Miles,
Bob's yer Uncle
Yeah its true that the Alberta Progressive Conservatives are a pretty big tent and certainly choosing Morton or even Manning to a lesser degree could push some Red Tories over to the Liberals. Likewise choosing a Red Tory could push some over to the Alberta Alliance although considering the Liberals got under 20% in most rural ridings and under 30% in most Calgary ridings outside the downtown core, a split on the right would only mean a stronger opposition, not a Liberal win. I think the important thing is to have a leader who has a bold vision that people from the centre to far right can support. Ralph Klein was able to do this. Some leaders such as Jean Chretien, Ralph Klein, Gordon Campbell, Brian Mulroney, and Stephen Harper were good at keeping large groups of diverse people together while people such as Paul Martin and Joe Clark weren't so good at this.
OK Mr. Lunn, the comparison between Ted Morton and Preston is not factually accurate.
Look at this article in McLeans mag.
In particular this question.
Question: Am I wrong in suggesting that, historically, Alberta leaders have won office more by running against Ottawa than by talking about Alberta's internal issues? I haven't heard you speak about federal-provincial issues yet.
Preston: ...Alberta's capable of entering into these memorandums of understanding with other provinces -- it's done quite a bit of that already -- and finding things it has in common with other provinces and doing some things together. It's doing that more and more with British Columbia -- I think it should do it with some other provinces as well. So Alberta's role in the federation is changing from more of an aggrieved party, the old western alienation West-wants-in theme, to a potential leader in Confederation. And again, my question to Albertans is, if you wanted me to be involved with the Alberta government, does Alberta want to lead, or does it want to put the wagons in a circle and say, "To heck with the rest of the country." I'm not interested in the latter option.
Preston supporters are not even on the same playing field as Ted Morton. Preston Manning, as am I, do not exactly fit into left-right preconceptions.
Preston Manning may have toned down his right wing rhetoric somewhat but the platform he ran on as Reform Party leader was quite right wing. Also his father as premier EC Manning was pretty right wing. In fact he was the last staunch conservative (both fiscal and social, Mike Harris was only on the fiscal side) to become premier. Second of all he betrayed the Progressive Conservatives by creating the Reform Party. While it is true that federal and provincial politics are different, some loyal Progressive Conservatives like myself have no time for former Reformers whatever level of government they run at.
"Also his father as premier EC Manning was pretty right wing."
Uh huh, my grandfather lived in Ohio, my father was a community man and farmer who only knew rural life. I am an engineer who has lived in cities for over half my life. Generations are very different from the one before.
"Second of all he betrayed the Progressive Conservatives by creating the Reform Party."
OK, this is unfair. The PC party of Brian Mulroney was as corrupt and arrogant as that of the current Liberals. The Reform Party prevented the outrage in western Canada from building into a "West wants out" separatist sentiment and channelled it into a federalist "West wants in" sentiment. Funny, I would blame Jean Charest and Joe Clark (of Alberta to be fair) for being close-minded enough to avoid re-merging earlier. Reform supporters were formerly part of Mulroney's party.
You can keep your mind closed but if Canadians keep their minds closed on Liberal policies, the federal Liberals will never form a majority again.
Off course people are different than some of their relatives, but I believe Preston Manning is too right wing to be premier of Alberta. The Reform Party may have succeeded due to Western Alienation, but it was primarily created since the Progressive Conservatives weren't right wing enough. Had they not cloaked it up with the West wants in message and instead focused on their extreme agenda, they probably would have done no better than the Alberta Alliance did last provincial election. If anything the Reform Party only helped further alienate the West from the rest of Canada as it just played to the stereotype that Westerners were a bunch of rednecks, which off course they aren't. Had we in the West chosen a more centrist party to represent the West's grievances, I believe there would have been far fewer problems.
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